laurentja
Posts:122
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stinkyhelmet
Posts:94
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laurentja
Posts:122
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| 09/25/2013 12:43 PM |
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Just released this morning. chrishornerracing.com. So, now I don't know squat about blood values in elite cyclists, but he is consistently at 45% hematocrit, even in the very early season. I know during the early EPO heyday they put a cap at 50% so all the doped riders were coming in "coincidentally" at 49%. I thought even top amateur cyclists were at more like 40%...?
I really DO want to believe in Chris, as I always have been a fan, and perhaps he has such a well-tuned engine that it's all legit. If not, why would he have released this data? It shows he is consistent, for sure. But real/consistent? |
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jmdirt
Posts:775
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| 09/25/2013 12:57 PM |
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| When I had access to free testing at a university physio lab I tried to run a blood pan. monthly and mine was usually ~42 (I never tested in December and only once in Jan and Feb). I wish I would have saved all of that info. |
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C2K_Rider
Posts:173
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| 09/25/2013 02:02 PM |
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Posted By Justin jmdirt on 09/25/2013 12:57 PM
I wish I would have saved all of that info.
Because your massive beat-downs of local riders will cause them to accuse you of doping? |
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Pin0Q0
Posts:229
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| 09/25/2013 02:23 PM |
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| Maybe there is a new drug/doping method that we'll hear about in a few years......Not probable but possible. |
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Entheo
Posts:317
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| 09/25/2013 02:29 PM |
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| well, good on him for making that data public. the hematocrit certainly seems within the bounds of believeability. i may have to dial my skepticism of his win back a little. |
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jmdirt
Posts:775
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| 09/25/2013 02:36 PM |
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| C2K, the old lady who lives two houses down thinks that I doped to edge her to the stop sign! |
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Pits
Posts:6
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| 09/25/2013 02:55 PM |
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| I'm sure if the numbers were on the edgy side, he would have withheld the data. Good on him. |
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Oldfart
Posts:511
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| 09/25/2013 03:14 PM |
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| 45 is what I would call normal for an elite endurance athlete. Higher than the average schmo but average does not cut it at the elite level very often. It should drop over the course of a hard stage race I think. Is there evidence of that? |
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stronz
Posts:447
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| 09/25/2013 04:11 PM |
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http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/horner-releases-biological-passport-results
read the first coment by guy incognito. then tell me you think he's clean. reticulocytes shouldnt go down the way they did. Only way is with a bag o blood. I think this will actually cause a $hit storm for ole CH |
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stronz
Posts:447
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| 09/25/2013 04:13 PM |
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here's the comment by guyincognito. Dont know who he is but what he says does make sense. And consistent with what I have read about reticulocytes and how they react to Hct.
These blood values are just like the ones Lance made public in 2010:
They appease the casual fans who can't interpret them, but are in fact deeply unsettling if you know what you're looking at
Haemoglobin rising during a 3 week competition? A small rise of 0.1-0.2% would already be unlikely, but several percentage points? Obvious red flag. The only other explanations for it would be severe dehydration or pregnancy. I doubt he won a 3 week race while severely dehydrated, and I know he wasn't pregnant.
At the same time, retics decrease, and not by a small amount. They decrease BY MORE THAN HALF. The typical reaction of anyone's body to a blood bag infusion. Red flag.
The off-score variations are not on the limit of believability, they are a very long way above it. A varation of minus 15.6 in a week???
There are not nearly enough retics in his blood in early 3 week GT tests to account for the increase in red cell count in tests days or a week later. Where did those red cells come from? Did they appear by magic? A transfusion is literally the only possibility.
10% expansion pre-vuelta? There is no possibility for that other than blood bag
Comparing that to his Giro values from before his ridiculous transformation and they don't look like they even belong to the same person!
I'm afraid to even look at the rest. I took one quick glance and saw a FORTY POINT VARIATION IN OFF-SCORE!!!!! Why not just carry around a neon sign announcing you're on EPO?
This is not good. This is very not good. |
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Keith Richards
Posts:781
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| 09/25/2013 05:13 PM |
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| I am not trusting anyone named "guyincognito", sorry. |
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| -----
It is his word versus ours. We like our word. We like where we stand and we like our credibility."--Lance Armstrong. |
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Orange Crush
Posts:4499
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| 09/25/2013 05:20 PM |
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What Keith said, incognito gets corrected/challenged further down the comment box; there will be lots of "experts" each with their own opinion, until a real expert waves his/her magic wand I would not hang my hat either way.
One thing's for sure, Horner gets tested about as much as the entire Jamaican athletics team. |
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Ride On
Posts:537
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| 09/25/2013 06:02 PM |
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| If it was that obvious we would be hearing from Travis any day now. |
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